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Author Topic: On the Wray out?  (Read 2588 times)

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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #15 on: »
A new team with exactly the same players but not necessarily in the same positions.

Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #16 on: »
Sir Ian McGeechan has penned a hagiography to Wray in the Telegraph today.   It is not written tongue in cheek either.   Joe Marler has added his thoughts about it on his Twitter account.    “Crawl out mate”.     Well said Joe!!
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #17 on: »
There are two lenses here. As a guy who has unstintingly backed Saracens and probably saved them from folding multiple times over, and as a lifelong supporter of rugby, Nigel Wray deserves a lot of respect.

But there are a dozen or so other well-heeled businessmen who have also invested heavily in keeping their favourite rugby club afloat and competitive. These people spend millions every year to service clubs’ debts - which in most cases keep growing year on year - in the hope that one day the sport will become sustainable.

As someone who was prepared to systematically undermine the terms that they had all agreed between them to keep rugby sustainable, not once, but twice and with the full extent of his distortion of the cap never being made apparent, Wray deserves condemnation.

Rugby would be poorer without his largesse, but it is also poorer because of his cheating. I suspect he’s largely moving aside now because of the optics for Saracens - having a different ownership and his own role significantly reduced may well be the result of pressure from sponsors and other financial backers as the price of continued involvement.

Although his exit isn’t complete, it probably does mark the point at which we should put it behind us, unless further evidence of wrongdoing emerges. Which I hope will not be the case, but they do have form.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #18 on: »
There are two lenses here. As a guy who has unstintingly backed Saracens and probably saved them from folding multiple times over, and as a lifelong supporter of rugby, Nigel Wray deserves a lot of respect.

Absolutely no he doesn't, because of this:

As someone who was prepared to systematically undermine the terms that they had all agreed between them to keep rugby sustainable, not once, but twice and with the full extent of his distortion of the cap never being made apparent, Wray deserves condemnation.

No apology, no contrition means no trust or respect can be given

Rugby would be poorer without his largesse

I don't think so, rugby is better off without cheats and those that try to turn it into football

Although his exit isn’t complete, it probably does mark the point at which we should put it behind us, unless further evidence of wrongdoing emerges. Which I hope will not be the case, but they do have form.

And again, it's a big no from me, see above regarding apology and contrition.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #19 on: »
Everyone except the most swivel-eyed Sarries fan knows they did wrong: they been punished - perhaps not far enough for some - but do we have to keep going on and on and on about it?

Some on here couldn't bear some of the opprobrium we received 10 or so years ago - can't we agree to just get over these issues and move on?

Perhaps DOK/Admin can make a separate forum with space for Sarries-Wray-Salary Cap stories...

Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #20 on: »
It's a forum, the point of which is discussion and debate.

I feel very strongly about the continued cheating, some agree with me, others not so much. It's why we discuss it.

No one forces anyone else to read threads the titles of which generally align with the content

Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #21 on: »
Everyone except the most swivel-eyed Sarries fan knows they did wrong: they been punished - perhaps not far enough for some - but do we have to keep going on and on and on about it?

Some on here couldn't bear some of the opprobrium we received 10 or so years ago - can't we agree to just get over these issues and move on?

Perhaps DOK/Admin can make a separate forum with space for Sarries-Wray-Salary Cap stories...

It's a current topic. It's relevant. If you're not interested, visit other topics!

Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #22 on: »
It probably wouldn’t be discussed if there hadn’t been two separate  articles this weekend saying how wonderful they are and how badly treated they have been, and that followed up by Joe Marlers comments
So it is topical

Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #23 on: »
Absolutely no he doesn't, because of this:

No apology, no contrition means no trust or respect can be given

I don't think so, rugby is better off without cheats and those that try to turn it into football

And again, it's a big no from me, see above regarding apology and contrition.

Agree totally. The only thing that would make me forgive the club is admission of guilt and an apology. The whole time they're still marching around with stars all over their jerseys, I'm not interested. Which I don't expect will change.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #24 on: »
You are of course more than entitled to; have fun.


Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #25 on: »
You are of course more than entitled to; have fun.



For someone not interested, I really can't work out why you continue to visit this thread.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #26 on: »
I find it odd that the likes of Stephen Jones (well maybe not him, he's a special case) and Geech can't seem to get why fans and players of other clubs may find the eulogising that has gone on since the incident seriously grating. As well as the not involved but clearly involved recent announcement.

While I feel it's probably getting to a time to move on, whitewashing the past and praising certain characters to the hilt certainly won't help that process.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #27 on: »
I knew I was going to be bitter about Sarries for a long time after the return to rugby after the first covid lockdown.

Quins vs Sale at the Stoop, the return of rugby we all missed so much, I sit down to watch the pre game chat and what do I see....

A interview with Owen Farrell about how sad he is Sarries got the points deductions and how it might effect his England performance, no mention of Sarries doing anything wrong or difficult questions to Farrell about his property empire or the case against them.

Follow that up with all pundits saying how great they are, article after article about them, the Sarries boys being in the 6N squad and blowing it when we should of been building the squad like wales did i n the autumn cup.

Then saw they are getting on tv 8 out of their 9 games in this first block of 10 while Warriors are on once.

I am going to be bitter forever as all anyone seems to be doing is waiting for them to start winning again so they can talk about how great and hard done by they are.
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #28 on: »
"Then saw they are getting on tv 8 out of their 9 games in this first block of 10 while Warriors are on once."...

Their must be millions of armchair Salarycens fans then?
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Re: On the Wray out?
« Reply #29 on: »
I knew I was going to be bitter about Sarries for a long time after the return to rugby after the first covid lockdown.

Quins vs Sale at the Stoop, the return of rugby we all missed so much, I sit down to watch the pre game chat and what do I see....

A interview with Owen Farrell about how sad he is Sarries got the points deductions and how it might effect his England performance, no mention of Sarries doing anything wrong or difficult questions to Farrell about his property empire or the case against them.

Follow that up with all pundits saying how great they are, article after article about them, the Sarries boys being in the 6N squad and blowing it when we should of been building the squad like wales did i n the autumn cup.

Then saw they are getting on tv 8 out of their 9 games in this first block of 10 while Warriors are on once.

I am going to be bitter forever as all anyone seems to be doing is waiting for them to start winning again so they can talk about how great and hard done by they are.

is it just me, or did the media commentary on the event that shall not be named drag on for longer than the Salarycens and their cheating?
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