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Author Topic: Sale thrashing and now it’s official. We are simply rubbish  (Read 3171 times)

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Albig

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I doubt the contracts are that much when not playing for England - most contracts now are adjusted as and when you play for England. So in EPS get more - even mid contract etc.

Sounds weird but English players will get paid more by clubs even if they play less games, due to money they get from RFU.

dittonquin

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Our recruitment has perplexed me. Sale managed to bring in Lood de Jager - we never seem to be in the market for that sort of player. We are certainly not getting value out of the cap. Our injury issues are stuff of legend. We break centres and hookers like it's going out of fashion on an almost season by season basis.

Agree with this. You look at Sale's 2nd/back row options when all fit and they're unbelievable. Tom Curry, Ben Curry, Wilson, Beaumont, De Jager, Ross, Evans, LJ Du Preez, D Du Preez. Ok the Saffers won't be as expensive but even so. Then they can still pay De Klerk, Ashton, Solomona, McGuigan, MacGinty, van der Merwe, R Du Preez, Yarde etc

Maybe we do have too much of our cap tied up in 6 or 7 big names?

dittonquin

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The big issue was up front and not winning the gain line. I thought Lawday looked good, but have to disagree about Semi, I think he adds some magic but also gets us in trouble with his offloads. Think in 15’s he is a work in progress.

Lewies was very quiet this week as was EE. Symons worked hard but couldn’t make much headway.

Not sure why everyone is so critical of Santi and Martin. Joined us late in preseason, have been very much bench players to Care and Marler and not had huge game time. Can not expect unless they play regularly, particularly at 9, to be top rate. In fact not sure exactly what Santi has done wrong!

I probably am being a bit harsh on Botta. Landajo though has had chances to impress and just doesn't look on it yet. Hopefully you're right and he will come good.

Agree Semi needs to work out when to offload and when to hold on to it (not the only Fijian guilty of that, mind!).

Albig

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Sale have the smallest squad in premiership, but also few internationals, so they keep players all season. Very clever requirement- but it has taken Diamond years to get to this.

Our issue is that we have a squad that last season still had regularly 6 players plus in England squad. We are like Leicester as a squad make-up.
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Putneyquin

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It seems to me that our current problems are two-fold. One, the number of injuries, which means that currently half the team and most of the bench is at best second or more often than not, third or fourth choice players in their positions. We just won't win much with that profile, especially when we combine that with point two, the lack of power in our game. We are just too lightweight and not big and powerful enough upfront, not beating up the opposition (in fact, we're regularly getting beaten up). That's significantly down to poor recruitment, especially in the locks department. Compare and contrast with Sale. We just haven't recruited/retained very well, including in the backs (e.g. retaining Chisholm who is a poor third-choice; Goneva who's a poor fourth choice; Ismaiel, who to me looks like a last choice ...). A little bit is obviously about attitude, inevitably, especially when heads go down towards the end as they did last night, but I don't think it's actually the coaching or the game plan that's the problem.   
This is spot-on on both counts. And doesn't Gustard have to shoulder most of the responsibility for the poor recruitment? His first season delivering 5th and equal on points with 4th was good with the squad of JK/CoS. But  following his massive clear-out/change of squad this season feels like were back to the worst of the JK days! Feels like he's bought a rag-tag bunch of players, and so far no-one has really stood out, and lots look mediocre.  Even our defence, which PG seemed to improve last season, has gone down the drain.
Goneva is a classic example of this: what the hell are we doing buying him? He looks old, slow, drops off tackles... just don't get it.

Albig

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We signed Goneva after Newcastle went down and Visser’s retirement. He is probably on a cheap one year deal......Can not criticise PG for this signing or Tex or Ismaiel as they were all late deals due to injuries or retirements after the recruitment stages.

Is clear that both Goneva and Ismaiel are not and were not signed to be 1st team regularly’s.

SiB

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Gustards first season securing 5th was mainly with Jks  team wasn’t it?

You only have to look at the attached that aside from 11/12 over the last decade we really are 6-8th team


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Seequin

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We also have the worst points against in the league despite our coach being a defence expert.

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Comet

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I was watching Glaws v Bath earlier. A really enjoyable (derby) game, played at pace with energy and passion.

Now, we have beaten Glaws twice at home this season but I feel there is a lot we can take from them for when we play Sarries in our derby.

Firstly, they were fast! They were always moving onto the ball with pace and were running excellent support lines.
The decision making was great. They worked as a team and passed at the right moment more often than not.
They fought their tacklers and refused to be taken down easily. They always made ground and fought to get an extra few metres.

I think all of these things are critical for us to take on board, especially receiving the ball at pace. Poor old Symons yesterday, for example, was given the ball so often when he was standing still. He had to generate his own momentum against offside opposition coming to get him. It was very frustrating and I felt very sorry for him. The plan had clearly fallen apart.

Anyway, today has been quite bewildering. I feel quite numb! A win against Sale away would have been incredible and, perhaps, unexpected. The manner of the defeat really hurts, more than the defeat itself. Sigh.
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Putneyquin

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Gustards first season securing 5th was mainly with Jks  team wasn’t it?

You only have to look at the attached that aside from 11/12 over the last decade we really are 6-8th team
Indeed. Gustard should be judged on this season, with a team and a coaching staff he has created ... and so far, its looking like limited progress vs. the worst of the JK era.

Average league position for Quins is mid-table mediocrity: past 13 season average since promotion back to the premiership is 5.6 and 57 points. Avge under COS: 5th and 61 points, so slightly better and of course our only league title. Gustard first season 5th and 57 points.

You Shall Not Pass

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Poor old Symons yesterday, for example, was given the ball so often when he was standing still. He had to generate his own momentum against offside opposition coming to get him. It was very frustrating and I felt very sorry for him. The plan had clearly fallen apart.

I was hoping for some reaction from the onfield leaders. Time and again rushed passes were made to stationary receivers. It shouldn't have been inevitable that we would fall apart like that, (but it was). It seems when we find ourselves down we can't regather and skills and discipline fall apart. It's been happening for too long and we desperately need a solution.

A222Quin

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I’m sure Exeter take the view that their average league position prior to about 2014 was lower reaches of the 2nd tier...

The club claimed to have the ambition to challenge for things on the field. It just doesn’t appear to have the first idea how to do about it.

MadMax

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Former player upset at being released.

However one of our main problems is the total lack of discipline which has seen us regularly conceding a ridiculous number of penalties in games for several seasons now and there are absolutely no signs of the current coaching setup being able to rectify this.

Did I post something I shouldn't which caused this to be edited? Sorry if I did but seems to be word for word what I posted if I remember correctly.

DOK

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Did I post something I shouldn't which caused this to be edited? Sorry if I did but seems to be word for word what I posted if I remember correctly.

I think you'll find there was a bad word in the thread title that got changed (so all subsequent postings didn't continue to use it).

Grubs

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We also have the worst points against in the league despite our coach being a defence expert.


r

No we don’t. Wasps, Irish, Tigers and Wuss are all worse than Quins.

 

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