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Author Topic: The end of rugby?  (Read 2508 times)

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DOK

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #75 on: Thursday 24-Sep-2020, 19:56* »
Who said government priority?

dr_miles

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #76 on: Thursday 24-Sep-2020, 19:59* »
Well, what I thought we were talking about was the government bailing out sports.

My position was that the government has to prioritise spending, and sport generally and rugby union specifically won’t be high up on that priority list.

What did you think we were talking about?

Mayor West

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #77 on: Thursday 24-Sep-2020, 20:15* »
Rugby is no different to any other business. They need customers to generate income to be sustainable. If the government won’t allow you any customers then they must make sure you can survive.

dr_miles

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #78 on: Thursday 24-Sep-2020, 20:28* »
That’s true. But if it was a loss making business where you’re bailing out wealthy owners then I’m not sure that the government should step in. After all, how long is this going to go on for? How long do you think that the government should support it?

Fearless Fred

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #79 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 07:17* »
As a point of interest regarding "the arts" I can say from the standpoint of someone in an associated business (professional audio equipment used in theatres, gigs, concerts, recording studios, broadcast studios, etc) that the industry is feeling this HARD.

You may look at Gary Linekar (to use a tabloid staple of a "luvvie to hate on") & say they're all rolling in it. While a very few of the big name stars may be financially secure, the vast majority of those in the TV and Music business have had little to no support since the lockdown was started, and a lot of them are on low wage short term contracts for the duration of a tour/production. If the show doesn't go on, they don't get paid. When you see a band play at a moderate-sized venue like the Hammersmith Apollo, you may only think of the 4/5/6 guys on stage, but the crew required to setup & make the show run is more like 80 when you factor in the sound engineers, lighting crew, riggers, transport crew, etc. Add in the venue staff (box office, stewarding ushers, food & drink, and you're over the 100 mark very quickly. Even for the artists, a lot of them are not as well off as you think. Streaming brings very little revenue for them, even when they're established names. Album releases are often only break even of a tiny profit once you factor in production costs of studio & equipment rental, sound engineers, session musicians in some cases. Touring and Festivals is pretty much how artists & bands make a living, and that's been cut off.

The same is true in TV & Radio, there's a lot of staff that are needed to get the sound and pictures onto the TV, even for a standard News broadcast. The pressures on keeping overall costs low for TV News for example means that apart from anchors & key reporting staff, a lot of the reporters, especially when it comes to the local news are freelancers, not knowing from one month to the next who they'll be working for or even *if* they'll be working. When you get into the realms of TV Drama/Comedy, it's even higher, and the majority of them will be on very modest money and only get paid while the production is underway.

The entertainment/creative industries are estimated to be worth approx £110Bn to the UK economy, often driving secondary revenue into the economy (Going up to London to see a show? I know, we'll stay over, have a meal out beforehand). It's a MASSIVE part of the UK economy, as well as being part of the soft diplomacy that shapes how ordinary people in other countries perceive the UK, and it's mainly been cut off at the knees these last six months with no support.

Sorry, just needed to get that off my chest.
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DOK

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #80 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 08:46* »
Hey, some facts and perspective aren't always welcome on this board, but they should be. That was useful info FF.
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Fearless Fred

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #81 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 09:17* »
Hey, some facts and perspective aren't always welcome on this board, but they should be. That was useful info FF.

Thanks, DOK! It gets on my wick when certain columnists & commentators rail against the "Luvvies" without realising how many people in TV, Film, Music, Comedy Clubs, Theatres, etc are on modest incomes, many living from gig to gig (in both meanings of the word).
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dr_miles

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #82 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 09:54* »
This is an interesting commentary on the challenges facing sport:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/sep/24/never-waste-a-crisis-covid-19-trauma-can-force-sport-to-change-for-good

"It helps to define the terms of all this jeopardy. There has been a lot of emotive rhetoric about sport being on the verge of extinction, its very existence in doubt, as though the basic ability to participate, support and spectate could be vaporised out from beneath us.

This is incorrect. What is being menaced is the current financial management of professional sport, its existing models and cultural practices, much of which is pretty joyless and dysfunctional in the first place."
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Mayor West

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #83 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 09:54* »
Well said Fearless. I know and work (at the moment) for several people involved in your industry at all levels. They are all optimistic but close to the edge. One of them feels terrible about all the people that  rely on his company for work. They all have bills to pay and no income. And now it’s all been put back another six months.

A222Quin

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #84 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 10:09* »
This is an interesting commentary on the challenges facing sport:

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2020/sep/24/never-waste-a-crisis-covid-19-trauma-can-force-sport-to-change-for-good

"It helps to define the terms of all this jeopardy. There has been a lot of emotive rhetoric about sport being on the verge of extinction, its very existence in doubt, as though the basic ability to participate, support and spectate could be vaporised out from beneath us.

This is incorrect. What is being menaced is the current financial management of professional sport, its existing models and cultural practices, much of which is pretty joyless and dysfunctional in the first place."

I agree with the general premise of that, club rugby finances/financial expectations have been in cloud cuckoo land for a number of years with few exceptions. That said, at governing body level a lack of funding from the top of the sport (RFU, ECB levels) will affect the non professional clubs and that will affect participation at the other levels.

Saintquin

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #85 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 10:22* »
One of the problems in most, if not all, professional sport in this country is most of the income goes to few of the employed with a small amount going to the business for the future.  It almost like they don't care about the their employer or future employee's.
I know it's a short living but, I bet most of us on here have been employed by more than one type of business and if a player doesn't take that into account they're are a bit silly.
Surely we all need each other, players, owners, fans and all other staff. Without one you don't really have the others

deadlyfrom5yardsout

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #86 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 11:20* »
Being a tax payer I would rather the Government did not endlessly bail out businesses that are non-essential. Our collective and individual tax burden to pay for Covid is going to be massive enough as it is tbh. I love rugby but completely accept that we are not immune to outside forces and simply cannot go cap in hand to "Government" (ie our fellow tax payers) to underwrite our losses.

maybetomorrow

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #87 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 13:07* »
Leicester President Peter Tom said: "I believe Premiership clubs will fail" .....

https://www.rugbypass.com/news/i-believe-premiership-clubs-will-go-out-of-business-leicester//
« Last Edit: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 13:09* by maybetomorrow »

MadMax

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Re: The end of rugby?
« Reply #88 on: Friday 25-Sep-2020, 14:04* »
Thanks, DOK! It gets on my wick when certain columnists & commentators rail against the "Luvvies" without realising how many people in TV, Film, Music, Comedy Clubs, Theatres, etc are on modest incomes, many living from gig to gig (in both meanings of the word).

Indeed. It's a similar situation to folks condemning football because the players earn thousands a week when in fact it is only a very small minority of professional players who do. The vast majority scrape around trying to pay the mortgage like the rest of us.

 

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