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He's a decent player, but one of the best in the league seems a little overrated to me.
In Exeter he played 8 games in one season, 3 starting and 5 off the bench.
Not sure what the point is?? He could have played 1 game and still looked good. The first time I saw him play for them he stood out. Kenningham has played less than that for Quins and people seem pretty happy with him!!
When we signed him I was very happy, so far I dont think he has played as well for us and the times I saw him play for Exeter -
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Not sure what the point is?? He could have played 1 game and still looked good. The first time I saw him play for them he stood out. Kenningham has played less than that for Quins and people seem pretty happy with him!!
When we signed him I was very happy, so far I dont think he has played as well for us and the times I saw him play for Exeter
In my opinion he is a good player, but between that and saying that he is one of the best in the league there is a lot of difference.
For Exeter I only reported the statistics, then if he plays very well I will be the first to be happy.
O / T the championship this year is almost a comedy, the last game we played against GLO academy, even Bath (which at the moment does not seem to me a top 4 team) despite playing against a team with no ambition, the first half won 40-0.
Here we get excited immediately, as soon as a player never considered before makes a good performance.
Sometimes even before he plays: Ismael was bought watching a video on youtube, all very happy for Goneva (myself included) but he practically never recorded in any game .... and the list would not end here.
I am still waiting for the new talent who has arrived from NZ to play.
Of Collier Cavubati Campagnaro, no news, yet many thought they were good players.
It is not a controversy, but just my thought. -
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Er, Will Collier has 177 appearances for Quins, I'm pretty sure everyone's had the chance to develop their opinions of his ability over a long period of time.
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O / T the championship this year is almost a comedy, the last game we played against GLO academy,
That's unfair on Gloucester. They had 18 senior squad unavailable due to injury or call up. Like I said on another thread, they would've more likely targeted us as a potential game to pick up points rather than Exeter this coming weekend, so would've put out the strongest they could against us. Just think back a few years to when we had our perennial injury crisis (usually in the centres). We've been in the same boat ourselves at this point in the season & suffered accordingly. -
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Er, Will Collier has 177 appearances for Quins, I'm pretty sure everyone's had the chance to develop their opinions of his ability over a long period of time.
Maybe I explained myself wrong.
I liked Collier and I really like him as a player, I meant that he seems out of the team's games, as he only played 12 minutes against Exeter in this league. -
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That's unfair on Gloucester. They had 18 senior squad unavailable due to injury or call up. Like I said on another thread, they would've more likely targeted us as a potential game to pick up points rather than Exeter this coming weekend, so would've put out the strongest they could against us. Just think back a few years to when we had our perennial injury crisis (usually in the centres). We've been in the same boat ourselves at this point in the season & suffered accordingly.
Unfair? Mmmm
I did not say that it was Gloucester's fault, but for the serious problem of the corononavirus, many games were played with more than half a team out and fielded those who were available and in addition the young people of the academy.
Others games have not even played, but in any case the points in the standings have been given anyway. -
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I think perhaps Maybe is just trying to say that some people get carried away with praising some players and that some results are exceptional - all true.
Players that are having good games against poor sides need to be judged against the better sides, so their games against the Exeters, Bristols and Sales are the games to watch.
The Lawday stats quote reflect Premiership only and don't take into account the dozen or so matches he played in European and English cup games for Exeter. He also played a number of games for Cornish Pirates while on loan in his first season with Chiefs.
To be fair to Collier and Campagnaro, they have both had big injuries, so will find it a slog to get back into a successful 23-man squad - if they try hard, they will. Campagnaro is obviously still overcoming his injury and back training (as he's not on the injury list); Cavubati just isn't getting selected above Lewies, Symonds, Young, Lamb and Tizzard... -
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In my opinion he is a good player, but between that and saying that he is one of the best in the league there is a lot of difference.
For Exeter I only reported the statistics, then if he plays very well I will be the first to be happy.
O / T the championship this year is almost a comedy, the last game we played against GLO academy, even Bath (which at the moment does not seem to me a top 4 team) despite playing against a team with no ambition, the first half won 40-0.
Here we get excited immediately, as soon as a player never considered before makes a good performance.
Sometimes even before he plays: Ismael was bought watching a video on youtube, all very happy for Goneva (myself included) but he practically never recorded in any game .... and the list would not end here.
I am still waiting for the new talent who has arrived from NZ to play.
Of Collier Cavubati Campagnaro, no news, yet many thought they were good players.
It is not a controversy, but just my thought.
Apologies for that. My reply was in response to Lawday playing well for Exeter. My point was it did not matter how many games he had played, he looked good for them. I agree that saying he is one one of the best in the league, is currently way off.
Re the players mentioned, Collier and Campagnero are both good players. Both have had a tough time with injuries. Had they not, then I have not doubt they would have featured more. The problem I see both of them having, since they have been out, other players have come in played very well. Both play in areas we have strength in depth now and I can see both finding it tough getting back in.
Cavubatu, I think most only ever saw him as a decent squad filler. Again, the problem he has is Lamb and Tizzard coming into the side and taking their chances -
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Re the players mentioned, Collier and Campagnero are both good players. Both have had a tough time with injuries. Had they not, then I have not doubt they would have featured more. The problem I see both of them having, since they have been out, other players have come in played very well. Both play in areas we have strength in depth now and I can see both finding it tough getting back in.
Cavubatu, I think most only ever saw him as a decent squad filler. Again, the problem he has is Lamb and Tizzard coming into the side and taking their chances
Completely agree with you, Collier was a player who was rightfully relied on a lot, I don't know very well the cause and duration of his injury, but when he played he was always one of the best, especially in a closed scrum.
I was just wondering why nobody talks about it anymore, not even regarding the timing of his return to the team.
Campagnaro has had a very bad knee injury, and it is already the second time, here in Italy it is said that he is already training with the team, and frankly when he played he always seemed to me a good player.
I would like to try the combination with Esterhuizen and see what happens.
Cavubati, if I remember correctly, it was bought mainly because Kunatani didn't "feel" alone in the team and the following year I always think for the same reason Goneva too, but I can be wrong.
Of course, if you don't play for 1 year and someone who takes your place plays well, it's hard to get back to play in the 23. -
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I think the main reason people have not spoken much about Collier returning to the team....we have not missed him. Thats no disrespect to him, just highlighting the depth we have now.
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I think the main reason people have not spoken much about Collier returning to the team....we have not missed him. Thats no disrespect to him, just highlighting the depth we have now.
Collier at his best was a bit behind Sinckler in the loose but probably the most technically proficient scrummager I've seen - there was one scrum against Argentina on the "while everyone else is away with the Lions tour" where he held rock steady against a much more experience pack for 30 seconds. Since then, he's had a string of injuries and hasn't had a run of games to re-establish himself.
Even fully fit he's probably behind Louw, but he ought to be toe-to-toe with Kerrod for the backup slot. The big question is whether he's now had too many injuries to get back to that level. -
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Collier at his best was a bit behind Sinckler in the loose but probably the most technically proficient scrummager I've seen - there was one scrum against Argentina on the "while everyone else is away with the Lions tour" where he held rock steady against a much more experience pack for 30 seconds. Since then, he's had a string of injuries and hasn't had a run of games to re-establish himself.
Even fully fit he's probably behind Louw, but he ought to be toe-to-toe with Kerrod for the backup slot. The big question is whether he's now had too many injuries to get back to that level.
I'm not doubting that. Collier is a very good player when fit and would be first choice at most Prem sides. If he were injury free, he could find himself on Englands radar. My point was, with him being injured, we have not missed him. Not in the way we would miss Marler, Baldwin, Smith etc. There is no drop down in quality or effectiveness. The players we have at TH now, I think he will struggle to get his place back. Not because he is not worth it, because those in front of him are very good. Ultimately, my thinking was, with the reduced cap, the options we have at TH, Collier could be the one to make way (esp with kerrod singing a new deal). Not a dig at Collier, more a victim of circumstance if you like. -
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I'm not doubting that. Collier is a very good player when fit and would be first choice at most Prem sides. If he were injury free, he could find himself on Englands radar. My point was, with him being injured, we have not missed him. Not in the way we would miss Marler, Baldwin, Smith etc. There is no drop down in quality or effectiveness. The players we have at TH now, I think he will struggle to get his place back. Not because he is not worth it, because those in front of him are very good. Ultimately, my thinking was, with the reduced cap, the options we have at TH, Collier could be the one to make way (esp with kerrod singing a new deal). Not a dig at Collier, more a victim of circumstance if you like.
That's fair. Though I'd argue that any team in the world would miss Marler and arguably Smith at the moment. Baldwin's playing well but is a little more replaceable. -
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